NO2ID

I am a UK citizen and have a British Passport (expires 2009), but I'm also an Irish citizen and entitled to an Irish Passport. I realize that Irish citizenship will not (in the end) save me from getting an ID card, but I want to avoid the 'passport catch'.

My question: will travelling in and out of the UK - to any destination - on an Irish passport create any problems given that a scan of the passport might (??) show that I have (or, post-2009, will have had) a British passport?

No. There are several places where being Irish is treated with less suspicion than being British, I can't think of any the other way. Why should your Irish passport acknowledge your British one? The whole point of Irish citizenship being available to all those born on the island of Ireland is that the Irish state is not interested in their being British subjects.

I am an Irish citizen living in Britian and do not have a British passport....and have never ever had any problems (bar the few dodgy Irish jokes)

I'm seen it suggested in another topic (http://forum.no2id.net/viewtopic.php?t=8241) that the Irish might be the only people that the UK government could not force to register on the NIR, and was wondering if somebody legal could comment more widely on this? Perhaps the answer is that we can't tell at the moment, as the legislation to make it compulsory has not been passed yet. Nevertheless I would have thought we could make an educated guess as to what is possible.

As far as I'm aware the situation is:

If you're British and live in Britain, then there will be no hiding place when they make NIR compulsory for you.

If you're other-EU and live in Britain for over 3 months, the government will probably try to make NIR compulsory. However EU citizens have free movement within the EU, so couldn't they just leave the country and then come back again to reset the clock?

The nice thing about Ireland is that it forms a Common Travel Area with the UK, so the British government doesn't know about it when you travel to or from Ireland (you don't need a passport or anything). So anyone could claim they've left the UK to go to Ireland, even if they haven't, making the resetting-the-clock trick even easier (if indeed it works in the first place).

I know that Irish have special legal status because of the legislation that made Ireland independent, but I confess I'm not at all familiar with it. Does it make a difference to NIR?

I am interested because I may be able to claim Irish citizenship, and I travel to Ireland every couple of months anyway. If I become Irish, I could then let my British passport lapse. But could the lack of a British passport excuse me from registration? I'd still be British after all, even if I didn't have a passport.

I'm sorry this is a jumble of issues, but the "Irish question" is of interest to a lot of people with Irish relatives, and I hope that somebody might be able to help us all understand it.

neither the British nor the Irish authorities would know you have dual citizenship unless you tell them. so don't tell them.

all other things equal, if you're entitled to dual citizenship, grab the passport while you can is my suggestion. you never know what might happen in the future.

Irish Nationals will be outside the ID Card system. It's a major loophole that B'Liar forgot about. The 1948 Nationality ACt grants Irish Nationals the right of travel and abode within the UK, and also, the Good Friday Agreement declares that anyone living in Northern Ireland will not be required to declare their nationality and can opt for Irish or British citizenship as they see fit.

SO it would require the UK Government to enact primary legislation that would affect some 13 Million people to close that loophole… Good Luck with that one Neue Arbiet!

If Irish citizens are outside the scope of the ID scheme one could argue that British citizens are being unfairly discriminated against on the grounds of nationality/race ??..that's illegal isn't it ??

The end of the Common Travel Area is already foreseen by both the Governments of the UK and the Republic:

Travellers between the Irish Republic and Britain will need a passport when schemes launched by the two governments come into force.

Irish officials have been asked to work on ending an agreement permitting free movement between the two jurisdictions.

........

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/7059580.stm

I let my UK passport lapse a few years ago and use an Irish one and am an expat (from both countries) I have never had any problems using my Irish passport and in fact its less expensive to purchase/renew

i am still a bit confused, perhaps not suprisingly! i was well versed in the ID card stuff a while ago but have to admit to completely losing track lately. can someone advise if getting an irish passport (which i'm pretty sure i'm entitled to) now is

a) a good idea - because it means i'll be able to have a new passport without having all my details registered on the national identity database (am i right in thinking that if i renew my uk passport now, it's too late to avoid this???)

b) a bad idea - because it will mean i'll have dual nationality so will be forced to get an ID card sometime soon - maybe even this year??

my main priority is to avoid being included on some hideous database, though to be honest i quite like the idea of having an irish passport, too.

just lastly i note that the irish passport does have a biometric chip but i assume that this isn't a big deal ie not linked to some big brother style database?

If you renew your UK passport now you will not be entered on the NIR, because they haven''t built it yet. You will not be fingerprinted, nor asked for your DVLA, NI and other "official" numbers. You will receive a "biometric" passport, but for the moment this just means a passport with your digital photo encoded in a chip.



The "ID cards for foreitgners" headlines the Home Office have been so keen to generate actually means "Biometric visas for the small percentage of foreigners who already need a visa. This does not include citizens of any EU country, and also excludes many other visitors who stay less than 3 months."

In short, Irish passport holders will not be affected.[/quote]