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 Post subject: q) about history of no2id
PostPosted: Sun, 24 Dec 2006 00:40:47 +0000 
Sorry about this, I am sure I missed an obvious lnk but can someone please tell me the history of no2id.
I read where you say - "we are members of all political parties and none" etc
and this interested me. I believe no2id will be a significant part of the political history of England one day, much like the poll tax protests and The Battle of Orgreave etc. This is an area of history that greatly interests me and I wondered if there is a place I can find more about no2id.

For example do any politicians in parliament rank amongst your number?
What brought no2id to the forefront of the debate, how did word spread?
At what rate is support gaining for no2id?
How did the founder members come to know of each other etc?

I am deeply interested in the history of industrial and socio/political relations
in Britain and will continue to look for more info but it would help is someone could point the way and to other sympathetic organisations.

Thank you


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PostPosted: Tue, 26 Dec 2006 22:16:03 +0000 
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To answer your specific questions:

1) Yes, we have Parliamentary supporters in all the main parties - and in both Houses. See our page on 'Public figures against ID'.

2) NO2ID has so far been a campaign of both (mostly!) elegant tactics, and a lot of hard work. The public campaign managed to get noticed by the media pretty early on at least partly because we were very fast-growing. We also know what we're talking about. I have been told that NO2ID was the most rapidly growing civil liberties campaign in recent British history - from a pub meeting of less than a dozen volunteers (a week after a public meeting attended by about 350 people at the LSE) to 10,000 registered supporters in well under a year. But then we were fighting a live Bill in Parliament from just a couple of months after the public campaign's official launch...

Use of e-mail and the web certainly helped in the early days, as did starting local groups, networking with other organisations and making sure we were present at significant events - e.g. party conferences, the ESF, etc. Putting a lot of effort into the media side of things didn't hurt, either. Most of our early 'actions' were deliberately photo-oppotunities, not protests or demonstrations, something for which we took some flak at the time.

3) NO2ID currently has around 30,000 registered supporters, but - as we are a privacy campaign and don't care to ask people for their details unless they want to give them to us* - we almost certainly have a lot more people working with us, e.g. through our local groups (quite a few of whom run their own independent mailing lists). Our broader network of affiliate organisations allows us, in theory at least, to reach literally millions of people. Unison alone, which voted to affiliate to NO2ID at its last national conference, represents 1.3 million public service workers.

Public support for NO2ID's position has risen from 20% in the polls to around 50% - the highest it has been is around 55% - but there are clear indications within the detail of various polls that things will move even further in our direction as people begin to understand the consequences of the database state, and (eventually) feel the ID scheme itself begin to bite.

Hardcore opposition - i.e. those who say they'd refuse or go to prison, rather than have a card - has risen from around 3 million in 2004 to almost 9 million, on the poll figures. I've heard people say that, all in, the Poll Tax involved around 17-18 million people - from those who simply ignored their bill, to those who went to prison - so, assuming people can be motivated to act, we're halfway there with at least another two years to go. (We don't underestimate that assumption, by the way).

4) I thought we had something on this on the main website, but - on checking - it appears we don't, so I may as well write something here. [N.B. This is a personal account, so any mistakes and/or omissions are mine and mine alone.]

'NO2ID' was first used as a brand name as far back as 2002, by a number of individuals working for different NGOs who shared concerns that ID cards might be back on the political agenda - I assume because of the events of 9/11, but you'd have to ask them. I know that they published at least one pamphlet under the NO2ID name, because I've seen a copy. I think they may also have produced some badges. They certainly managed to piss off the Home Office. :D Stand's (successful) attempt to get people to respond to the Home Office 'consultation' on "Entitlement Cards" was treated as a single negative response, despite some of the 5,000 genuinely individual responses that were sent via Stand's site being clearly in favour of ID cards...

This same group - drawn from Privacy International (whose Director, Simon Davies, was NO2ID's first Chair), Liberty, Charter 88 (Debbie Chay is now serving her second term as Vice-Chair of NO2ID's Advisory Board), FIPR, The 1990 Trust & Stand - organised public meetings, and it was at one called 'Mistaken Identity' at the LSE on 19th May 2004 that the current public campaign was declared. Many of the people who adjourned to the Three Tuns pub after that meeting are involved in or close friends of the campaign to this day.

All those who were interested in getting involved met up in The Newman Arms pub one evening about a week later. There were less than a dozen of us at that meeting - some from the existing groups, others (like myself) just concerned members of the public.

Some of the people obviously knew each other from before, but we all pretty much just mucked in and got on with things. I'd made some T-shirts on my PC at home, and had been mucking around with the logo - as had Chris Lightfoot, IIRC - so we pretty quickly settled on a basic design. We appointed Mark Littlewood - who I believe was at that point on sabbatical from Liberty, where he was Director of Campaigns - to lead the group and started to create the bare bones of a proper public campaign, including a draft Constitution.

I ended up being lumbered with handling the finance (including sorting out a bank account!) and fundraising side of things, others - Owen Blacker & Adam McGreggor - got the mailing lists and website up and running, and Mark either co-opted people or introduced new folk to the group. I certainly remember meeting Charles Farrier, Andy Robson (who'd been working since very early on within Charter 88) and Dave Walker at those early meetings. Guy Herbert (at first editor of NO2ID's newsletter), Cassandra Rae and Guy Taylor also got involved almost immediately. [My apologies if I've forgotten anyone - give me a nudge and I'll edit you back in!]

You can see the notional shape of the organisation at that point by scrolling down to the bottom of our first newsletter, which was published on 26 July 2004.

NO2ID's official launch, by which time we'd got our first grant from the Joseph Rowntree Reform Trust Ltd, was in Covent Garden on Saturday 18th September. Our first AGM was held on 9th October - at which NO2ID's original Advisory Board was elected by the paid-up members and Mark Littlewood was confirmed in post as National Coordinator. If you want any more 'forensic' detail from this period, its probably easiest just to read our old newsletters:

http://www.no2id.net/news/newsletters/newsletter.php?issue=2
[to move to the next newsletter, just increase the last digit of the URL in your browser address bar by one].

Do have a read of the main website. There's a lot of material there, though you may have to dig for some of it. We've been fighting flat out for over 2 years now, and our archiving isn't always what it should be.

Phil Booth
National Coordinator, NO2ID

*e.g. to get a FREE supporters pack, or receive our newsletter. You can sign up here.


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PostPosted: Wed, 27 Dec 2006 20:31:59 +0000 
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The key is local area participation. Each of us needs to build a fortress around themselves and that would be the whole town against it, from the Mayor, the councilors, the entire network. The authorities will learn that the Englishman's home is indeed his castle. The way to do it is for the pressure to start at the bottom of the hierarchy and progress up the system. First the local council decides it won't agree, then the district council and so on and simultaneously in every department. It will end up where the Home Office is sending out instructions to its army but nothing is happening.

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"It's easy to win forgiveness for being wrong; being right is what gets you into real trouble."

Bjarne Stroustrup


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PostPosted: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 02:12:20 +0000 
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Baron von Lotsov. wrote:
The key is local area participation. Each of us needs to build a fortress around themselves and that would be the whole town against it, from the Mayor, the councilors, the entire network. The authorities will learn that the Englishman's home is indeed his castle. The way to do it is for the pressure to start at the bottom of the hierarchy and progress up the system. First the local council decides it won't agree, then the district council and so on and simultaneously in every department. It will end up where the Home Office is sending out instructions to its army but nothing is happening.


BvL (and others),

You will note that this is precisely what NO2ID has been doing - sans the castle metaphors - for over 2 years now.

Our local group network is a way for people who feel strongly about this issue to come together and take effective action in their town or area. If you read these forums and are not yet an active member of a NO2ID local group then please make it your New Year's resolution to join one. And if there isn't one near you, start one - to find out more, send an e-mail to local.groups@no2id.net The reality is that time and energy spent on local group activity is hugely more useful than time spent posting on the forums.

Soon to be updated, our councils (and unions) page indicates that it is entirely possible to get your council, union or other bodies to take a notional stand against 'ID cards' even now. Groups as small as 2 or 3 people have successfully lobbied their council to pass motions against the ID scheme, and to affiliate to - or at least assist - NO2ID in that area. You will probably find that, this year, you are pushing at an even more open door than before in all but Labour controlled councils - though we have had success in some of them, too (we have learnt never to assume people's position on ID, just because they are of a particular party).

If you are in a local group and haven't done so already, make 2007 the year you lobby your Local, District and County Councils to pass motions against the ID scheme. If you start now, your group will probably be experienced enough at networking and lobbying to be much more effective by the time of the May elections...

With the ID scheme, the government is trying to turn huge numbers of people into de facto, unpaid immigration officers, benefits investigators, Home Office administrators, etc. and many don't like it. Most of the big unions are already against ID cards, on various grounds, and several - most recently the NUJ - have voted to affiliate to NO2ID.

Far from having an "army", the bullyboy Home Office is looking more and more isolated - even within government. Did you note the appalling level of 'buy in' from other government departments in the recent 'Strategic' Action Plan? Months after forcing through the Act, HO still hasn't really convinced anyone. The ones to watch now are Treasury (source of the 'Citizen Information Project') and Cabinet Office ('Transformational Government') - both of which have far subtler ways to press gang the public sector and seduce private business...

Phil Booth
National Coordinator, NO2ID


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PostPosted: Thu, 28 Dec 2006 23:35:12 +0000 
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Mod Note : re-read, sorted etc etc

normal service has now in theory been resumed :)


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